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November 17, 2005
HarryTho 11/17 Natalee Holloway Update And Commentary
Topics: Natalee HollowayOwing to the fact that this is a delayed posting for Thursday night's piece, we'll begin the Natalee update with what was to be the recap, especially in light of reader's interest in the Amy Bradley story. But first, we want to make a few important administrative comments.
As a point of note here, Hyscience does not usually cover missing person's stories, other than Natalee Holloway. The rare exception has been at the request of the family of a missing person and we believe it is a public service to do so.
Just looking at our banner, you can see what we're interested in, and what the focus of our posts are - it comes from our backgrounds, our experiences, and world views(see profile). We just happen to have been interested in Natalee's disappearance from day one, and have more or less stayed with it for both readers and ourselves.
Amy Bradley's story just fell into our lap, delivered by a reader that had obviously spent a lot of time researching the matter, and even then, when asked to refrain from posting on it by her family, we did so for almost two months. Only after one of the images that we sent to the family showed up on Dr. Phil, in the context of what appeared to us as an amateur hour for back street wannabe detectives - presented as (made for) reality TV, and not very smart ones, at that, did we move ahead with the story.
And one more important item before getting to Natalee. We believe that an interested, informed, and motivated readership, is a far more valuable tool for discovery, than a truck load of media hypists and their comedic side shows.
We believe that a blogger's job is to try to sort out the information and present it in a useful, interesting, entertaining, and educational manner(with both quality and substance), something that we always strive for, but are subject to falling short of on occassion. And when we do fall short of sorting out the information and presenting it in an a useful, interesting, entertaining, and educational manner (having both quality and substance), it's the readership and our fellow bloggers that help steer us quickly back on target, which has occured on more than one occassion. That's the real difference between a blog, and a newspaper or cable TV show, and sadly, often even cable news.
And that's why we don't ban posters that may disagree with us - only if they become obvious "trouble makers" and an annoyance to other readers, or if profanity is used.
NOW we can get on with Natalee's disappearance.
Perhaps the more exhilarating event of the day was the Dr. Phil Show. Dr. Phil, supported by a cast of the usual Twitty-Holloway camp gang, unveiled a miniature potential of a sex trade angle involving Curacao. With that announced, he then aired reels of scenes from Cancun, Mexico and Venezuela where Jamie Skeeter and Ty Ritter ambled about as inept white hunters. Other than a picture of present day Amy Bradley, Dr. Phil offered little evidence to support his sex trade theory.
With this collapse, Beth Twitty then supported her theory of her daughter calling her from Mexico some five weeks ago. She employed her professional credentials as a speech pathologist to stamp her approval on her credibility in assessing her daughter's voice on the phone. With this said, a high-drama chase of Natalee's kidnappers (while the three suspects were incarcerated) captured the imaginations of the Dr. Phil audience. The storyteller, a "Mr. Kim" of the Diario newspaper, was reported as describing daring helicopter escapes and huge, barbed-wired facilities containing prostitutes. The story closed with Jossy Mansur refusing to print such fables in his Diario newspaper.
In essence, Dr. Phil exhibited a few pictures of Amy Bradley, escapades of a couple of white hunters in Latin America and some new footage of Beth Twitty revealing a belief in her daughter being alive in the sex trade. The show offered no conclusion, and no meat. After all, it was merely an overdramatized pastiche of unrelated events.
Rita Crosby followed with some sex trade wisdom from Pat Rutherford. Pat was more persuasive than all of Dr. Phil's charade. In a few minutes, Pat was able to correct all of Dr. Phil's white hunters errors. The only other memorable news came for the revelation that the Ventura Office of the FBI has Jamie Skeeter's tapes as of 9:00 AM Thursday morning 17 November 2005.
Clearly, a far more convincing theory was presented on this blog months ago for Natalee's abduction into the South American sex trade. Had Dr. Phil referenced our research, he would have been able to connect his scattered scenes in a cohesive and persuasive story. Even the alleged forensic study of Amy's body tattoos would have come from our site or our email communications, and the entire world would not have then known that potential rescuers of Amy were about to close in, and her captors, if indeed there are captors, would not have been forewarned.
In closing, one should take a good look at the difference between Amy Bradley's pictures before going missing and her recent pictures. With that image firmly framed in your mind, you should be able to envision how Natalee Holloway will look in a few more months in sex slavery, addicted to heroin and having been thoroughly beaten into submission. Time may be short for Natalee, if she is still alive.
Moving on to a couple of news items (if we can still call cable TV - news):
Joe Scarborough of MSNBC News hosted Beth Twitty over her Dr. Phil appearance and her revelation that she felt it was her daughter on the phone from Mexico.
It was pretty much a repeat of her appearance earlier on Rita Crosby. Clint van Zandt was a little more forceful about the FBI's capabilities.
Rita Crosby hosted Clint van Zandt, Jamie Skeeter, Harold Copus and Pat Rutherford. Clint wants a new team of Dutch profilers. Jossy Mansur contradicts Clint and degrades the Dutch all together. I wonder why? Harold Copus supports Clint. Truly, Clint and Harold seem to have the better idea. Dave Holloway just wants a new investigative team.
Jamie Skeeter has given the tapes to the Ventura Office of the FBI this morning at about 9:00 AM. Brooks Scientific Institute will exam the tapes, as well.
Pat Rutherford came through with the greatest understanding of the sex slave trade. He even mentioned "mardino" ... a practice of using the people on the ground (country natives) to be your eyes in the searches for the missing girls. It saves getting a knife in your gut, like Ty Ritter. Rutherford is not a flake, at least in knowledge.
(Ty Ritter should start his own comedy hour, a modern version of the Keystone Cops turned sleuths for missing persons).
Next came the Diario investigator that tracked Natalee and her kidnappers all over Aruba ... even some high drama scenes came out ... it was interesting. Then, Jossy Mansur came on to say that what his reporter, Kim (high drama pursuit guy), discovered about Natalee on Aruba failed to meet the standards in order to print in the Diario newspaper. Yes, we have discovered a new line in order to express the ridiculous!
From Dr. Phil and MSNBC News, Clint van Zandt is announced as a former kidnap investigation specialist with the FBI. Now, he seems to have backtracked on his disavowal of any possibility of Natalee being in the sex slave industry into a supporter of Harold Copus and Dr. Phil's ideas. We presented more to our readers a few months ago than was revealed tonight by Dr. Phil.
And lastly, for now, comes a small voice of reaseon in, "Former government spokesperson creates even more anger against Aruba in the U.S., " via Aruba Getagrip:
DIARIO Aruba 11/16/2005We must keep in mind, from our research, the family to lose the most from an American boycott of Aruba would be the Mansurs. Accordingly, any attempt to disgruntle the USA would be tragic for Jossy.
If everyone knows that in the US certain persons want to use the case of Natalee to create sensation, and while there isn't a solution to the case, any declaration a little on the outrageous side on the part of Aruba, can end up adding fuel to the fire, then why are there in Aruba supposed heroes who believe that they can go confront them macho-style, who can do even more damage in the case of Natalee?The time has come for the people of Aruba to pull themselves together and see how together they are going to get out of this problem which has been caused by a couple of people and now is affecting the future of the country of Aruba.
For all those who believe that they can fight an elephant, while they are nothing more than an ant: you are doing more harm than you know and the majority of the people didn't ask for you to do even more damage.
Instead of looking to confront the police corps, prosecutor, American press and a long list of more people and institutions who have to solve the case of Natalee, the best way to take care of this case when questions are asked, is not to get into confrontations with anyone, but to ask all persons or institutions, be they local or foreign, to help us solve the case because today Aruba stands alone in the battlefield, fighting alone against injustice with a people who have no art or part in this.
As for the statement from Ruben Trapenberg, I am sure that he is feeling the heat from the American media. We have to admit that our American press and media, via the cable news networks, presents a powerful front. From our American media, without realizing it, Ruben has internalized that the USA screwed up early in the invasion of Iraq. Ruben has not reflected that the comedy of clowns that he confronts in our American media are precisely the same comedy of clowns that he has internalized with respect to the USA management of the Iraq invasion.
I believe that Ruben has fallen to pray to old adage that you have to trust somebody.
I'd like to remind readers that, as was mentioned in my recap - given in today's introduction, we need to think once more about taking a good look at the difference between Amy Bradley's pictures before going missing and her recent pictures. With that image firmly framed in our minds, we can envision how Natalee Holloway will look in a few more months in sex slavery, if in fact she is still alive, addicted to heroin and having been thoroughly beaten into submission.
So it's worth repeating here, time may be short for Natalee, that is, if she is still alive.
Aloha.
Posted for HarryTho
Posted by Richard at November 17, 2005 10:09 PM
Articles Related to Natalee Holloway:
- Aruban Authorities Dismiss Charges In Nataliee Holloway Case - Mar 17, 2008
- New Rumors Surfacing Surrounding Natalee Holloway Case - Mar 10, 2008
- Report: New Evidence In Holloway Case Derived From Phone Conversations (Update) - Nov 23, 2007
- Natalee Holloway's Dad To Search Deep Seas - Nov 23, 2007
- Natalee Holloway Case Back In The News - Nov 21, 2007
- Natalee Holloway "Readers" Ask For More - Oct 12, 2006
- HarryTho 8/2 Natalee Holloway Commentary - Aug 02, 2006
- HarryTho 7/8 Natalee Holloway Commentary - Jul 07, 2006
- HarryTho 6/16 Natalee Holloway Commentary - Jun 16, 2006
- Harrytho 5/26 Natalee Holloway Commentary - May 26, 2006
Comments
we demand our Harry fix !!
Posted by: chemtrail at November 18, 2005 7:52 AM
I keep thinking about how Natalee is fairing, if indeed she is trapped in the sex slave industry. I pray for the girl every night. I'm not sure I understand what you are saying about everybody helping in the investigation. I think the old saying, "too many cooks spoil the broth", would fit here. But definitely the FBI should be doing more to question the MB students and the family than they have. It's as if the FBI is in a contest with the ALE and they are fighting for top dog position. This won't work and has been a problem in America also. Remember what the local police say about the FBI in America. "The FBI couldn't find a whore in a whorehouse". That phrase has been used in this country for as long as I can remember. Ego's have become a real problem in this case and of course the interference of the family. Beth can't run this investigation and she should butt out if she really wants to find her daughter. Dave is getting as bad as her, having secret meetings behind the backs of those in charge. He is dividing the team and that accomplishes nothing. The media has hindered this investigation as much as the family. I'm not sure it can ever be solved and the only real VICTIM in this entire case is Natalee Holloway.
Posted by: flightoffancy at November 18, 2005 11:54 AM
You know, harry, when you count how many times the victim's name is mentioned these days compared to the programs in the beginning, well suffice it to say....certainly not nearly as much as then, now.
As an educated person, I am totally confused. Having read everything out there I would submit to you that my fellow readers are also totally confused. What direction are we headed in again?
Who was it that we are searching for, what was her name again?
Posted by: fightthegoodfight at November 18, 2005 12:30 PM
Dear fightthegoodfight:
I believe the immense response to the case of Natalee's disappearance has evolved beyond the boundary of a single personage. The call for support of Natalee Holloway reaches further into our social contextualization and emerges as an expression of our revulsion with those parasitic individuals, camouflaging their immoral activities within the confines of accommodating countries. Contempt surfaces for these same countries, harboring these demented, social parasites, as we are barraged by their screams for the sanctity of their sovereign rights. The call for justice overflows our national boundaries. It is my belief that those voices demand atonement from the countries permitting sexual slavery to prosper. Our enforcement agencies, currently basking in a wait-and-see mode, will soon be pressed to act without regard to the sanctity of sovereignties. That is the direction the support for Natalee Holloway is evolving. Iraq should have been harbinger to the world's social deviates. America is donning its armor in full battle dress.
And yes, the cause for Natalee Holloway is a good fight!
With Aloha,
Harry
Posted by: harry
at November 18, 2005 1:48 PM
hi Harry
D0 you think that the Natalee Holloway story can no longer stand on its own so they are adding Amy Bradley to try to keep NH in the news and also it sounds like Dr Phil and Beth would involve any one that they felt would help them keep their very tired facts and also their over kill of this tragic mystery and to involve the parents of Amy and her family would be a very cruel act upon these people
I hope i am so wrong about this,but look who we are dealing with
Posted by: candy at November 18, 2005 4:20 PM
Harry says:
"It is my belief that those voices demand atonement from the countries permitting sexual slavery to prosper."
Shucks, Harry, you can't go hardly anywhere in the United States without seeing strings of young girls on street corners, usualy doped up and 'looked' after by minders. There is an alarming traffic in young people brought into the United States to work off their fare in cribs under conditions of virtual slavery. Go to Tijuana...watch the flood of eager purchasers heading down there with bills in their pockets.
"Our enforcement agencies, currently basking in a wait-and-see mode, will soon be pressed to act without regard to the sanctity of sovereignties."
Prosecute the customers who leave North America to purchase their jollies with sex slaves and kids and, wishing to keep it up and save the airfare, look to purchase in America what they had had to travel out of America for in the first instance.
"That is the direction the support for Natalee Holloway is evolving. America is donning its armor in full battle dress."
Really? With Good Sir Mammana in his shining armour showing the way? And Beth's other hero, Saint Jossy, offering go-fasts for quick water transport? I was in Vietnam in the 60s, and I remember the 12-year olds kids selling their goods to the fully armoured GIs.
If you are suggesting that the funds donated to HollowayMediaInc are going to be used to better anything outside of the Holloway-Twitty clan, I would ask you to list one thing (outside of the addition of that $35,000 Tundra) that the funds have been used.
"And yes, the cause for Natalee Holloway is a good fight!"
Do you think the pimps will be shaking in their boots because Beth Twitty is on TV every night, boycotting Aruba? Why doesn't she call for a boycott of purchased sex in America, just for a start, if she wants a useful cause?
Posted by: dayo at November 18, 2005 5:22 PM
Dear Dayo:
When America decides to clean up the sex trade overseas, you can bet your bottom dollar that the American pimps will be shaking in their boots. When American embarks overseas by setting aside sovereignty rights, a number of other rights will be set aside, as well. After all, it appears that our criminal element seems to be quite fond of ignoring them, we should entertain that ignorance ... at least momentarily. Give them a good taste of oppressive chaos, until they fall to their knees and beseech a return to the sanctuary of sanity and human rights. Our American ancestors in the Middle Ages devised some novel norm-adjusting techniques that proved quite persuasive in deterring wrongdoing. Remember, for those who choose to abandon the rules of cordial, social behavior, there exists some rather interesting fellows quivering with anticipation to entertain them.
Enacting these Draconian measures are not novel. Every so many centuries, when the society seems to have strayed into chaos and lunacy, social engineers have stepped forward in order to right the wide deviations. The action is not a problem. The only impediment is the rhetoric. We can handle it.
If I were an American pimp, I would take these boisterous calls for justice in the case of Natalee Holloway quite serious and consider a career change.
With Aloha,
Harry
Posted by: harry
at November 18, 2005 6:09 PM
Dear Harry,
Your most recent comment makes it apparent that you're taking stand against sex-for-pay in general rather than against contemporary slavery. These institutions are very different. Majority of prostitutes work voluntarily, and in countries least diligent in fighting slavery most slaves are used for other purposes than sex.
Furthermore, you in fact advocate USA fighting most of the World to eliminate prostitution by force. I see that attitude strikingly similar to one condemned in Richard's post at http://www.hyscience.com/archives/2005/11/osama_bin_laden_2.php .
Posted by: George at November 18, 2005 6:54 PM
" I would take these boisterous calls for justice in the case of Natalee Holloway quite serious and consider a career change."
The boisterous calls that I have seen are
1...donate
2...slander, slur and malign the Kalpoe and van der Sloot families
3...revenge is mine, sayeth Joe
4...rape and kill Joran and Deepak
5...remove the Aruban government, police force and prosecutors and Aruban/Netherlands Antilles judiciary
6...boycott Aruba and Holland
7...punish the deemed guilty for just being there; with no proof of a crime required or of guilt of anything other than that--and there were lynchings, on that basis, in Alabama right up until 1982.
Justice, as I know it, calls for a crime and proof of guilt in that crime. My inbox is full of boisterous calls for justice from HollowayMedia Inc.'s followers--and rapes, bodily harm and prayers figure heavily in the messages.
Vigilantism, as practised so enthusiasticly in The United States (and it was very much an American phenomena), certainly cut into the pool of black breeders and did wipe out witchcraft in Salem; but lynching blacks didn't change the skin colour of those left unlynched (and that was why they were lynched, right?) and those killed in Salem were just innocent unfortunates.
The Inquisition, not operating in America, gleefully burned Protestants, Jews, Muslims and people who suggested that church officials repay borrowed funds.
Hmmmm? Borrowed funds? The US owes trillions to foreigners...will Bush set up an Inquisition to reduce foreign debt?
You'll pardon me if I remain unconvinced about the nature of those calls for justice. Nancy, Greta, Beth, Ty, Phil, TJ et al don't have the collective wit or intelligence of a dozen fruit flies and, if they are to be the investigators, prosecutors, judges and jurors of this New World Order, then America is going to have a tough time selling it to Americans--never mind the rest of the world.
You'll pardon me as I go off to strap on my own personal armour--a jock strap, reversed, to protect my nether regions from the onslaught of this new type of justice as I've seen, in my inbox, what Beth's followers have in store for those that don't drink deeply of the Kool Aid-filled cup.
Posted by: Dayo at November 18, 2005 6:55 PM
Dear George & Dayo:
I am certain that you are aware of the stance of this blog as in opposition to the "... boisterous calls for justice ...." I pray you do not condemn us for understanding the end product to which these "... boisterous calls for justice ...:" unfold. The prior comments were an effort to articulate their trajectory. However, I fear our voice will soon be drowned by the tidal wave of insanity swelling up in support of those "... boisterous calls for justice ...."
With Aloha,
Harry
Posted by: harry
at November 18, 2005 7:21 PM
Thank you, for that last sentence.
I, too, fear for the future; but my anxiety will be eased somewhat by knowing that your voice won't be adding to the clamour of the herd.
Best regards.
Posted by: dayo at November 18, 2005 8:09 PM
harry:
as always thanks for sharing your take on this case
this is a simpistic question:
if amy bradley & natalee are being held against their will....is it not it the height of stupidity to be broadcating these shows at this time?
Posted by: chip at November 18, 2005 9:59 PM
Dear chip:
In the case of Amy Bradley with respect to the pictures above, we were asked not to publish our findings. We didn't, until Dr. Phil went public, last evening, on national television. What I learned today is that the evidence for Dr. Phil's telecasted expose on Amy Bradley most likely came from the information that our research shared with the family and the FBI.
To ease your concerns, we were informed that locations where Amy Bradley was allegedly held (in the pictures above) were infiltrated by undercover agents without success. I can only surmise that Dr. Phil received the OK to air what he did last evening.
With Aloha,
Harry
Posted by: harry
at November 18, 2005 10:25 PM
Monsieur Harry,
What is going to happen if they do not find Natalee; are they going to keep on going with the same circus forever?
The Phill show IMO was only to keep the comedy alive.
À bientôt,
antoinette
Posted by: antoinette at November 18, 2005 10:30 PM
harry;
i hope you did not misunderstand.sometimes i am not articulate
i do not question your ethics on this...nor dan riehl's.........you two are a light in the darkness as far as i am concerned
but this whole episode has made me seriously question the ethics of our mass media....& i think it is very dangerous
with great respect,
chip
Posted by: chip at November 18, 2005 11:10 PM
Dear chip:
Words however uttered are temporary, it is their affect that is eternal.
With Aloha,
Harry
Posted by: harry
at November 19, 2005 3:40 PM
















